How many EZFKA kids will be delivered up to Deus Scientificus?

Let’s throw some darts at the board and work out how many kiddies (5-11) are going to be signed up to medical experiments.

It is claimed that we are currently (mid Jan) at 13%:

my guess is that we’ll see the number rise to 40%-50% quite quickly and then a slow trickle up to about 60%. At 60% or so is where it’ll probably plateau out unless new frighteners or coercive measures are deployed.

What do youse all reckon?

3.7 3 votes
Article Rating
205 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Coming

The new bogeyman is MIS-C, which is a rare complication of covid in children but quite severe

Estimates are between 0.002 and 0.0316% incidence following infection
(20 – 316 per million – quite a wide range admittedly)

Mortality rate from MIS-C is about 1-2%

Pfizer vaccine “estimated” to reduce incidence by 90%

Again, its the absolute risk reduction that is relevant here

If you only have a 20 in a million chance of contracting it, reducing that risk by 90% makes it 2 in a million, still 5/8ths of fuck all

If you consider death, then the chance is as little as 0.2 per million infections, so the pfizler would reduce it to 0.02 per million

Coming

Well it’s a condition that pre-dated Covid, but obviously the exact mechanisms remain unclear so the cause could be absolutely anything

it’s an association

bjw678

Pfizer vaccine “estimated” to reduce incidence by 90%

Is that like it was estimated to prevent 90% of infections…

stagmal

see norman fenton’s exercise of absolute vs relative risk reduction

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRLWXnBoXZI

Last edited 8 months ago by stagmal
Reus's Large MEMBER

Given the EZFKA units urge to comply I think that 50% is possible, but given the push back from anyone I know that has kids, it could surprise me with only 30-40% compliance.

Agent 47

Still don’t believe the 90% jabbed figure nationwide.

For me it’s likely 60-70% realistically for 16 and over.

plaguerat

You have to remember that the 90% jabbed figure is of the “eligible for vaccination” population…….if the NSW figures are anything to go by, the % of the total population jabbed is more around 70-75%.

Still a lot of sheep, though.

T

comment image

Let’s see how it plays out. Could be nothing.

Reus's Large MEMBER

One can only dream about such things coming to fruition

Stewie

True – but I did sense a shift in the Matrix the other day.

There is no way I will be there to support everyone who pushed and supported the vaccines, they can expect the worlds biggest “You were fucking wrong you collective bunch of retarded imbeciles. Naah naah naaa-na naaa-na” from me.”

Last edited 8 months ago by Stewie
Reus's Large MEMBER

Yes there have been a few events recently that makes me think that change is afoot, not sure if it will be any better for us though

Notably the Pfizer CEO saying that the current two jabs don’t really work against Omicron, that kinda ruins the narrative for any mandates till at least March when they release the Omicron version that we should get here in Oz by around 2025 if #scottyfrommarketing has anything to do with it. Also notice that reporting around the adverse reactions to the jabs is getting louder.

bjw678

the Pfizer CEO saying that the current two jabs don’t really work against Omicron, that kinda ruins the narrative for any mandates

Wasn’t he saying you need the booster, not that it doesn’t work? Talking his own book.

Literally the first line of their press release:

  • Preliminary laboratory studies demonstrate that three doses of the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine neutralize the Omicron variant (B.1.1.529 lineage) while two doses show significantly reduced neutralization titers

What it does is create the narrative for mandated boosters.

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Reus's Large MEMBER

Current two jabs offer little if any protection against Omicron, the booster will give some protection against hospitalisation and death, but the new “Omicron” version releasing in March will work.

So about 40% effective which is what the current ones were against Alpha.

However in practice and going off the data from the UK, the double jabbers are more likely per 100k to catch whuflu, and according to US data about 6-8 weeks after the booster the same thing. How that plays out with deaths will take another 30-60 days to find out as that seems to be how long they can keep them alive for (them being the overfed and nearly dead)

bjw678

Are we at about 4 months per new variant?
Next one should be around just in time to make the omicron specific vax useless…

Reus's Large MEMBER

Exactly, which is why I think that they will abandon it, if everyone has had Omicron then why would you get the jab for it, I know that people are dumb but there are going to be a lot more that realise that it makes no sense to get a booster / new jab for something that you have already had anyway

So that is why I think that the change will be to the treatments rather than the jabs, that way they can sell their treatment packs to the scared public / governments for $700 a go rather than 2 x $30 for the jabs.

bjw678

Lolz, the US government is not being blackmailed by the chinese government…
and if they were it wouldn’t be to release the “lab origin” of wuflu.

The forced release of the data used to approve the vax for use may force a change of narrative over the next few months though…

DictatorDavid

If they mandate kids having wax then the percentage will end up being much higher than 60%. So the question should be how likely are they to mandate it for kids to attend school…?

Reus's Large MEMBER

Given the comments on any MSM video I have seen, the mood out there is leave the kids alone so I expect that they have been getting a feel for the mood of the populace and the populace is not happy about it, so with the looming elections it would be political suicide to mandate the jabs for kids right now. By chance it could be that the self centered prick #scomo might actualy by accident save the kids.

Last edited 8 months ago by Reus's Large MEMBER
Coming

Anecdata from my circle of local parents of 5 year olds in an expensive area of Sydney

everyone except me and one other couple (also doctors) is at least mildly enthusiastic about jabbing their kiddies

most have already booked or got their kids shot

all highly educated (and/or trust fund kiddies from old money) and ultra high earners

It will be the shazzas and dazzas , Facebook professors from the school
of hard knocks , University of life types who will refuse to get Jayden and krystal their shot

stagmal

and autistic ppl like us on the internet

Manny Poohammer

You’re the wealthy guy who got shot to keep your job right?
You’re not rich, you’re not wealthy – you da govt bitch.
Enjoy your jabs.

Coming

yeah you’re right

im so sad i got the jab that did me no damage, instead of giving up my satisfying, high status, high income career and becoming an outcast

fuck you are a muppet

bjw678

would you be saying the same if you collapsed with heart problems?

Coming

No I wouldn’t

would you be saying the same if you were about to be intubated from Covid ?

you can only look at statistics and hope they’re accurate

bjw678

would you be saying the same if you were about to be intubated from Covid ?

Probably. Much the same as if I was being intubated for the flu. I’d imagine both groups share a large crossover.

you can only look at statistics and hope they’re accurate

Time and again the provided statistics have been proven wrong, why would you even bother believing them any more.

Coming

What would you base your decision on then ?

roll a dice ?

honestly you are a pretty stupid bloke

bjw678

I’m stupid?
You are basing your decision on statistics provided by a group with a massive financial interest in the outcome.

Do you understand the following? Was it a likely outcome? One that I predicted 18 months (TM) ago? Would past confirmed unrelated and unbiased information be something reasonable to base things on?

either COVID-19 vaccination nor infection appear to confer lifelong immunity. Current vaccines do not offer sterilizing immunity against SARS-CoV-2 infection. Infectious diseases cannot be eradicated when there is limited long-term immunity following infection or vaccination

honestly you are a pretty stupid bloke”
You are nowhere near as smart as you think if you did not understand the above 2 years ago…

Have we ever produced a long term effective vaccine for a respiratory disease?

You suffer from the same blindness many “educated” but not particularly critical thinking people do. You can’t see the big picture because you are focussed on a single detail.

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Coming

If you’re not basing your decision on statistics , what are you basing them on ?

anecdotes of people you know ?

religion ?

So yes, you’re a stupid cunt

bjw678

Gee, a bit butthurt there.
Good counter argument.

The PRIMARY thing I actually based it on was what I was told by an old doctor a long time ago,

Never use a new drug in the first 5 years after introduction, and if you want to be really careful not in the first 10

And that applies AFTER the proper trials process.
Side effects of varying severity often go unnoticed even in proper trials processes let alone “emergency”.

Coming

So, an anecdote then

bjw678

lol.
The statistics required to make a proper decision won’t exist for years yet.
Your decision is based on a SINGULAR statistic that isn’t all that relevant.
How much protection the vax offers doesn’t matter if it’s only temporary.

I assume you are being fed a particular group of statistics from above? Couldn’t be any possible bias in their selection could there?
lol.
The statistics required to make a proper decision won’t exist for years yet.
Your decision is based on a SINGULAR statistic that isn’t all that relevant.
How much protection the vax offers doesn’t matter if it’s only temporary.

I assume you are being fed a particular group of statistics from above? Couldn’t be any possible bias in their selection could there?

ALso:

Have we ever produced a long term effective vaccine for a respiratory disease?

Anecdote or statistical fact?

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Freddy

How much protection the vax offers doesn’t matter if it’s only temporary.

I think that is where you are way wrong. The virus is highly contagious (more than common cold) and we will all catch it multiple times per year and retain some natural immunity. The highest risk is catching it before gaining the natural immunity.

Freddy

I should rephrase “catching it without any immunity”. Vaccine offers immunity, and you will gain natural immunity after contracting the virus.

Last edited 8 months ago by Freddy
Reus's Large MEMBER

I think that the pertinent question here is “is it worth the short term gain for long term pain”

So purely on a risk basis given current numbers from the UK for example my age group 40-49 the death for unvaccinated including those that die with not from covid is 7 per 100k. I am reasonably healthy so I am pretty happy to take my chances with a 99.993% or higher chance of survival, I am also not going to get all that sick especially now with Omicron being the prevalent flavour.

However the mRNA tech does not have long term trial data associated with it, the only long term trial data shows that none of the test subjects lived for more than 5 years which is why it has not been approved for use till now and is still under the “emergency use” cover.

Now also if I take my family and circle of friends, there are more that got bad side effects from the vaccines than those that had a bad dose of covid, most were over it in a week, and the un-vaccinated seemed to fair better than the vaccinated TBH.

Right now, the short term gain does not justify the long term risk

Freddy

Probably ~10 times higher risk in that age group but ok it is still pretty low for someone in their 40s.

You are exaggerating the “emergency use”. It has been tested on hundreds of millions of people for a year or so and no longer emergency use.

I have stated I wouldn’t get vaccinated if I was in my 20s. 40s yes for me. 30s not sure what I would have done. As Coming pointed out, it is a calculated risk for everyone regardless of whether you realise that fact or not.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Yes for it to pass it needs to have 5 years of trial data before full approval, just because hundreds of millions had the jab does not make it pass long term trials

Freddy

If your Zombie hypothesis eventuates, and 94% of Australians suffer certain death, be sure that some of those 94% will be hunting down the remaining 6%.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Zombie apocalypse could be kinda fun, I have a especially sharp axe called “betty” just in case such a situation eventuates.

However I think it may be a slower less obvious thing where we have increasing incidence of people dying from minor infections, colds and a increase in heart disease (which will be blamed on whuflu). I do think that there will be a large percentage of the population that will be fine too, most of them would have been fine without the jab, I suspect that the overfed and nearly dead are still going to be in the crosshairs of either the virus or the vaccines / boosters.

emusplatt

so 36 dead in nsw today..
quote:
“Of the three people who died aged under 65, one person was vaccinated against COVID-19 and two people were not vaccinated. All three people had serious underlying health conditions.”

apparently 33 plus 60’s died..
so lets wax schoolkids
MACH SCHNELL!!!

Freddy

Not sure what your point it. I have repeatedly stated the death rates rise exponentially with age, and that it was ridiculous to vaccinate children.

Coming

i dont think its ridiculous, its just that any benefit is absolutely marginal

the death rate from the virus is tiny
the death rate from the vaccine is an order of magnitude smaller than that
similarly the MIS-C and myocarditis rates are minor

Everyone getting into a flap about , or even thinking about making it compulsory is ridiculous

If people want it, let them get it

The primary motivation used to be that it stops the spread
Then when it was clear that it didn’t, the narrative changed to reducing the burden on the healthcare system

Its quite clear that a few dozen children across the entire country getting really sick will not significantly burden the healthcare system
It would be a drop in the ocean compared to the burden of RSV and flu in children

yet here we

bjw678

the death rate from the vaccine is an order of magnitude smaller than that

Citation required.
Preferably impartial.

emusplatt

reinforces the point , and the point is hiding in broad daylight and is ignored by msm

Aussie Soy Boy

Baby Boomers vote. 5 year olds do not vote.

bjw678

I think that is where you are way wrong. The virus is highly contagious (more than common cold) and we will all catch it multiple times per year and retain some natural immunity. The highest risk is catching it before gaining the natural immunity.

I don’t think this really makes sense. Everyone killed by the flu has probably had it before at some point…

Freddy

If you are comparing to the flu then you don’t understand the point being made. Flu has an R0=~1.25. It is barely transmissible and dropped close to zero in nearly every country including those that didn’t have lockdowns. You cannot catch the flu multiple times per year, which means your natural immunity will eventually drop right down.

Omicron estimated to have R0>3 (some saying >6) which makes it more contagious than the Common Cold. We will almost certainly catch it annually and probably multiple times per year. You will retain natural immunity between bouts.

This is why I think your perpetual vaccine booster theory is not going to happen. This thing will be over within a year or so as we get closer to 100% of people having contracted the virus.

bjw678

his thing will be over within a year or so as we get closer to 100% of people having contracted the virus.


The various countries that let it rip last year intentionally or otherwise would beg to differ…

edit:
The year before, damn new year…

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Freddy

Notice that Delta strain is disappearing worldwide. That implies some immunity from the more contagious Omicron.

bjw678

omicron* replicates faster & so out-competes delta.

That’s the story they are telling. IT just so happened to show up a few weeks after the lockdowns ended. How very convenient…

Freddy

Out-competes means you catch more contagious Omicron before catching Delta, and the immunity from Omicron means you can’t catch Delta.

bjw678

Except we have already established that even getting delta doesn’t stop you getting delta.

And no peachy, I am not looking up a soource for that:)

And PPS
it’s probably 3X or more death rate for non covid deaths vaxxed vs unvaxxed 18-39 yo in the UK data.

bjw678

expose might be a stretch…

bjw678

non covid deaths

as in you died from other things, like myocarditis, or blood clots, or god knows what other possible side effects there could be…

Pages 18 and 43 seem to have nothing at all to do with this.

Freddy

Didn’t notice you said that. I am curious to see your expose.

bjw678

Can we stop calling it an expose…

That’ll make me care about quality and it’ll never be finished.

Freddy

I knew you would zero in on that. Read the fineprint. They are basically saying someone unvaccinated would not GAF about getting tested for sniffles.

Now look at the more important hospitalisations and deaths.

bjw678

They are basically saying someone unvaccinated would not GAF about getting tested for sniffles.

Is that based on data or MAKING SHIT UP(TM)

Aussie Soy Boy

You can make an argument that someone vaccinated would not be concerned about having sniffles from COVID because they are little chance of being hospitalised.

Freddy

It is total cases which mean it is also measuring the behavioural patterns of who optionally decides to get tested. The proper way would be to randomly test thousands of people and ask whether they are vaccinated or not.

Hospitalisations and deaths less likely to measure behaviours. Although I am sure there would still be some people who think I am vaxxed no need to go to hospital, or virus is fake no need, etc.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Kinda, but it is more that with Omicron being so contagious that with everyone catching it their immune systems are primed and antibodies are flowing so that Delta can’t get a look in.

Immunity is the T cells that you get from infection that will have a “blueprint” of the viruses proteins such that it can recognise and deploy antibodies it before it can replicate too much and make you sick.

Note that the vaccines do the first part, but not the second as they only teach your body about one of the 29 proteins that the virus has so if that spike protein mutates like Omicron does then your body does not recognise it and you still get sick.

However the continuous “priming” of the immune system by the jabs and boosters is what the concerns are about, never mind the concerns of the mRNA tech itself.

Freddy

It is not kinda. Delta can’t get a look in means you have immunity.

Your understanding of vaccination and T-cells is wrong.

Real World Data: Pfizer Vaccine & Infections and Hospitalizations from Omicron #shorts – YouTube

Reus's Large MEMBER

mmm, that is not what the current data set is showing at all

Freddy

Point me to a dataset that contradicts the understanding that vaccine more effective at preventing severe-illness (T-cells) and less effective at preventing infection (antibodies).

bjw678

but I feel that at current time (when most people aren’t naturally immune) it’s more to do with pure replication speed

Are delta cases increasing any more slowly in australia than they were before omicron? Thats the relevant question really.

Freddy

There is still very little overall immunity in Australia so Delta may still potentially be rising. Govt has done their best to obfuscate so we will not know.

In countries that are further down the path you can see the one strain completely replaces another implying cross-strain immunity.

comment image

Can’t see the key in the chart. The last three strains are Beta, Delta, Omicron.

Omicron is already dominant in South Africa | The Economist

Last edited 8 months ago by Freddy
bjw678

In countries that are further down the path you can see the one strain completely replaces another implying cross-strain immunity.

I don’t think that is a reasonable conclusion. How does it work? Apple style, no backwards compatibility? You only get immunity for previous strains but no immunity for newer ones from older ones?

Freddy

That is not what was stated. Catching one strain gives you some immunity to another. They believe that is true with Omicron vs Delta, and what happened between Delta and previous strains. Omicron more contagious than Delta and gives you some immunity to Delta means Delta can no longer spread.

It is a hypothesis which they believe to be correct because immunity has been demonstrated in-vitro. But still a hypothesis.

bjw678

So why didn’t the first X strains provide protection for the later ones? It is a very convenient hypothesis.

Freddy

That’s it Peachy. Evolution.

No sympathy needed. It is hypothesis that has enough data to soon be peer reviewed as fact.

I think the confusion is with Natural Immunity also waning similar to vaccine immunity waning. Peachy contracts Delta two weeks ago, probably still has enough immunity not to get re-infected with Delta (and possibly Omicron) today, but may get re-infected in a few weeks’ time. When that time arrives it would more likely to be Omicron because it is more contagious (evolutionary edge).

Reus's Large MEMBER

body just gets challenged with the infection & natural immunity is so strong that Peachy feels no symptoms and Peachy’s immune system is upgraded to protect from omicron.”

Yes that is most likely scenario according to how our immune systems work

Freddy

They know the natural immunity wanes as it does with other coronaviruses. We just haven’t had a single strain hang around long enough.

bjw678

 It is hypothesis that has enough data to soon be peer reviewed as fact.

If the evidence is equivalent to the graph you posted above i really don’t think so, although the peer review process is far from perfect.

 but it stands to reason that for omicron to have “become a thing”, it must have had the cojones and inherent qualities to outcompete Delta when it first evolved.

Because that isn’t what the graphs show. There is a lul between variants. Delta had already died out mostly before omicron became significant in any way, and the same for the transitions for all the variants.
There was very little delta to outcompete when omicron appeared and nowhere near enough omicron to kill delta off when it was declining.

For more confirmation check the grey variant that peaks with the light blue and the dark blue variant, or the light blue that again peaks with the dark blue. Immunity has hardly been conferred if infections are increasing.

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Freddy

This one better. It doesn’t matter what the case numbers are, Omicron is much more contagious and has cross immunity.

comment image

Last edited 8 months ago by Freddy
bjw678

cross immunity based on what?
That infections from other variants are still increasing at the same rate when omicron is there as well?
To make that argument the daily cases of other variants would be FALLING while omicron cases increased not increasing.
And it doesn’t even show omicron as much more contagious, the other variants still have a greater proportion of all infections.
That headline completely misrepresents the data.

Freddy

If it is not obvious to you by that latest chart that there was no herd immunity, and that Omicron taking over, then whatever. Good for you.

bjw678

How much actual testing is done for this and how much is just propaganda?
Our PCR testing was shown to be nothing but smoke and mirrors when shit got serious, how much DNA sequencing are they going to be doing to determine what strain people have?

T

I don’t know if that is true. Nothing in the testing regime can tell the difference. They call it delta or omicron based on symptoms in patients.

My understanding is the testing is just for viral load. That’s why flu numbers have collapsed I think.

Freddy

They can tell the difference with genomic sequencing. It is more resource intensive so they tend to do with with small sample sizes to get an idea of percentages rather than specific counts.

In December, NSW sequenced prior positive swabs to understand how much Omicron was out there and when it first started.

COVID NSW: Retesting of COVID-19 swabs suggests Omicron arrived late November (smh.com.au)

Last edited 8 months ago by Freddy
Coming

state health departments and the TGA have a financial incentive to lie to me?

Of course the statistics are incomplete – but not taking the vaccine is a decision just as much as taking it is a decision

So you have to go with what you’ve fucking got

The CURRENT evidence suggests that the virus is not that dangerous to me, and the vaccine is not that dangerous to me either

One might be slightly more dangerous than the other, but in absolute terms it is negligible

Now, you and this other imbecile expect me to quit my job, which pays me tremendous amounts of money, and become a social outcast on the basis of this evidence

But you wouldn’t take the vaccine on the same evidence, because it isn’t “complete”

you are even worse than the “long covid” hysterics at MB

bjw678

state health departments and the TGA have a financial incentive to lie to me?

Given they have accepted all financial liability for any damages resulting from use of the vax, yes.

Of course the statistics are incomplete – but not taking the vaccine is a decision just as much as taking it is a decision

So you have to go with what you’ve fucking got

The CURRENT evidence suggests that the virus is not that dangerous to me, and the vaccine is not that dangerous to me either

One might be slightly more dangerous than the other, but in absolute terms it is negligible

UK deaths statistics show that you are twice as likely to die if you are 18-59 and vaxxed than if you ar unvaxxed. That is not negligible.
There may be other factors at play there but no more than with all the other statistics you are using to justify your position.

Now, you and this other imbecile expect me to quit my job, which pays me tremendous amounts of money, and become a social outcast on the basis of this evidence

I don’t give a shit what you do personally but will argue the point if you tell others what to do publically.

But you wouldn’t take the vaccine on the same evidence, because it isn’t “complete”

you are even worse than the “long covid” hysterics at MB

I won’t take the vax because the potential side effects for no long term protection seems pointless.
Lockdowns improve things statistically far more than the vax did, That is all there in the statistics you love so much.
Should we be continuing with them?

bjw678
Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Freddy

It is the standard statistical propaganda every single time. Vaccinations closer to 100% for higher age groups, closer to zero percent for the kiddies, bundle them together and presto.

Look at the stats within the smaller age groups.

Coming

People with pre-determined beliefs/faith twist the statistics to suit their own purposes

bjw isn’t smart enough to twist it on his own, but he probably read it from someone else on twitter

bjw678

LOl.
I just actually looked, the 18-39 data is pretty damning.
Have you ever done any investigation of statistics for yourself coming? Not covered much in a medical degree is it?
You claim to be following the statistics but haven’t even looked at them?

Aussie Soy Boy

Coming has a medical degree so his lifetime of learning is complete (apart from the 15 hours of professional development he does each year).

bjw678

And damn you for making me find out where this was. I’ve now dug into it and might have to write something…

Coming

it is fucking negligible because your chance of dying from the virus with or without the vaccine are fuck all if you are young and healthy

I didn’t tell anyone what to do – I was responding to the other idiot who was telling me I was going to die and I should never have got the shot

Obviously you are unemployed and a shut-in, so the consequences of not taking the jab are negligible for you.

My situation is different, so the negative consequences of not taking the jab were far higher
If it was just a personal health decision, I probably would not have taken it but it was marginal either way

I have had enough of talking to you for this week, you are too stupid to deal with

bjw678

it is fucking negligible because your chance of dying from the virus with or without the vaccine are fuck all if you are young and healthy

You seemed to have failed reading comprehension here.
Your chance of dying NOT FROM THE VIRUS is what is through the roof in the statistics.

But of course that’s that focus on a single detail not the big picture thingy again…

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Rahul Poohammer

my satisfying, high status, high income career

You got shot to keep your job. You aint free, you aint independent. You’re a slave. A Govt Bitch. Cope harder.

plaguerat

As an individual who has chosen not the be vaccinated (with the current offerings, at least), I hope and expect that those who have chosen otherwise will respect my decision.

As such, I think it is only right that we, in turn, show respect for the decisions of those who, often for very pressing financial and social reasons laid upon them by the authorities, have chosen, or been pressured, into taking the shot.

Participating in this new partisan social division takes attention away from the real issues at stake here, and simply provides a new spectator sport for those calling the shots.

plaguerat

If the decision made by the individual brings no harm to another individual, then I see no reason for moral judgement.

plaguerat

Maybe you could hand around copies of these articles when your group next gets together.

Although, “How to win friends and influence people” doesn’t exactly spring to mind if you do 🙂

The Cutter Incident: How America’s First Polio Vaccine Led to a Growing Vaccine Crisis

In April 1955 more than 200 000 children in five Western and mid-Western USA states received a polio vaccine in which the process of inactivating the live virus proved to be defective. Within days there were reports of paralysis and within a month the first mass vaccination programme against polio had to be abandoned. Subsequent investigations revealed that the vaccine, manufactured by the California-based family firm of Cutter Laboratories, had caused 40 000 cases of polio, leaving 200 children with varying degrees of paralysis and killing 10.
 
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1383764/

Covid-19: global vaccine production is a mess and shortages are down to more than just hoarding
https://www.bmj.com/content/375/bmj.n2375

The diversity, distribution, and complex integration of the various parts of the supply and manufacturing chains highlighted in the BMJ article provide plenty of opportunity for…….shall we say, stuff-ups.

Last edited 8 months ago by plaguerat
bjw678

all highly educated (and/or trust fund kiddies from old money) and ultra high earners

So people who follow the rules and do what they are told and have benefitted greatly from it.

Reus's Large MEMBER

mmm, sheeple that don’t want to risk their Champagne lifestyle in case they loose their meal ticket and social standings, I have friends like that too, they don’t really GAF about their kids, keeping ahead of the Joneses is more important to them.

Coming

you are absolutely delusional if you think rich people are any less likely to care about their kids

just a lie that poor people tell themselves to feel better , like rich people being unhappy

the reality is the opposite – a harsh truth

bjw678

just a lie that poor people tell themselves to feel better ,

Kinda like rich people thinking they are rich because they are smarter…

Reus's Large MEMBER

Nah bro, when I lived in Freshwater it was on display daily, the rich would do the best to palm off the child to the nanny or somewhere else so that they could lunch and golf etc. Them seemed to want as little as possible to do with their kids. Actually I saw that in a lot of places that I have lived around the world. Father spending 14 hours a day in the office and ignoring their kids on the weekends to do fun stuff, mommy ushering the kids out to school etc. so she can bang the pool boy ( I was that pool boy many years ago), babysitters, nannies, au-pairs and the list goes on of how the rich don’t GAF about their kids.

Coming

Rich people don’t live in Freshwater

the rest of your post is delusional

there’s a reason that poor white kids are more likely to grow up to be criminals, uneducated, mental illness, obese , drug addicts etc

it’s because their parents are more likely to be shit

the same problems aren’t as common in 1st generation migrants

Reus's Large MEMBER

The same holds true for Vaucluse, St Ives etc. It is not a place thing, it is how the rich work. Who else has nannies, au-pairs etc to look after their kids …

bjw678

Coming is just salty cause he can’t afford one…

Coming

what the fuck are you even saying

your initial premise was that rich people don’t care about their kids, and that they are just for show

its patently absurd

you are trying to cope with being poor

Reus's Large MEMBER

Do you think that I am poor if I lived in those areas, and do present a counter argument where rich folks don’t palm off their kids to others to look after

stagmal

“there’s a reason that poor white kids are more likely to grow up to be criminals, uneducated, mental illness, obese , drug addicts etc
it’s because their parents are more likely to be shit”

this is genetic, has nothing to do with home environments which we have known for a really long time have little effect on behavioural outcomes outside of outlier cases like extreme neglect/abuse.people with higher incomes just tend to have higher iqs, lower rates of personality disorders, etc, characteristics they transmit to their children

the most important environmental impacts on behavioral development are non shared household factors like womb effects, environmental exposure, and to lesser extent peer group influences, etc.

Coming

that really is not true

intelligence is hereditary, which is why I didn’t include it in my list

the other things are heavily affected by environment

T

Yep. It’s terrifying how shallow and cowardly the vast majority of people are.

It’s almost inconceivable how people in the past successfully fought for freedom and actually won it. Without the access to information we have. Must have taken great courage.

Pretty heartening though.

Aussie Soy Boy

Yes, I suspect Coming overextended maybe on the mortgage, sends the children to a $20k per year school, wife likes to get the tits and lips done. He likes to remind us he makes a lot of money and has high social standing, but clearly no financial freedom by the sound of it. There is no bigger mug with finances than a doctor I’ve seen it with my own eyes. Buy high sell low is their motto. It’s that god complex I suppose.

Aussie Soy Boy

True I’m in a bit of a time warp.

Gouda

There are certainly many mug doctors (myself included), but even for a specialist medico on the lower end of the earning scale 20k is basically 7-8 days worth of work.

Rahul Poohammer

Yes, I suspect Coming overextended maybe on the mortgage

Yep. Got the science juice to keep job, pay off debt.
Like you say, doctors are hopeless with finance.

Freddy

I find a little silly belittling Coming’s wealth on a supposedly Libertarian forum. He studied hard and worked hard for it. The old-fashioned meritocracy that Libertarians are supposed to be in favour of. We all had the chance to do the same. Give it a rest.

Aussie Soy Boy

I think Coming brought it up first.

bjw678

We all had the chance to do the same.

Do you know how restrictive the medical profession is to enter so they can maintain their earning potential. Very few will ever get that chance. And I believe it is now interview selection process not HSC results so will be an even bigger old boys job than it used to be.

Freddy

Despite the general immaturity on this forum, there are no kiddies here. Everyone raised in NSW or VIC and over the age of 40 understood the tertiary entrance requirements and the effort required.

stagmal

im not even 30

bjw678

Basically be in the top few percent at least of intelligence and work extremely hard.
That top few percent eliminates most people straight off the bat.
I believe the TER for medicine the year before I finished was 99.94. IE you had to be in the top 0.06% of HSC students that applied for a TER.

Freddy

eliminates most people straight off the bat.

It sounds like it eliminated you straight off the bat.

HSC is a piece of piss compared to what we learnt at uni. You don’t need to be a genius to get a high TER. You just need dedication.

And I don’t believe the difference in intelligence as big as some of you make it out to be. At uni, I befriended an older age student who was a year 10 dropout. His race and high school outcome would confirm the belief of many people on here that he is a dumb shit through genetics. Yet, he ended up sharing my enthusiasm and getting a HD average and topping the honours role. The only thing that changed between dropping out in year 10 and achieving a HD average at Uni was maturity and dedication.

bjw678

HSC is a piece of piss compared to what we learnt at uni. You don’t need to be a genius to get a high TER. You just need dedication.

LOL. I suspect you have spent your entire life around uni graduates and have never really had much to do with those who don’t make it.

The only thing that changed between dropping out in year 10 and achieving a HD average at Uni was maturity and dedication.

Plenty of relatively intelligent people drop out of education, often from boredom…

It sounds like it eliminated you straight off the bat.

I had no desire to spend my career dealing with people and their bullshit, at least on a constant basis. Still have to deal with it occasionally though.

And you know how the question of how does this idiocy continue always comes up?
It’s because a large number of people are dumber than you think they are, you just have no interaction with them.

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
Freddy

The same defeatist mentality preached by the Greens and their disciples. Of course you assume I am surrounded by privilege.

The only privilege I had is my parents belief in education as a path to a better life than they had. Fuck knows where I would have ended up if my parents had a defeatist mentality like you.

Stewie

everyone except me and one other couple (also doctors) is at least mildly enthusiastic about jabbing their kiddies”

Yup – I have to agree that that has been my experience so far. Out walking with my daughter and bumped into one of her friend’s parents, after the initial pleasantries “Daughter just got the jab and is at home not feeling well today. When is X getting her jab?”

Me “Errr….. maybe after she gets COVID if at all”

Poor daughter now has to have RAT in order to play with theirs now.

bjw678

Poor daughter now has to have RAT in order to play with theirs now.

So what do they think the vax is for? Or do they simply not think.

Reus's Large MEMBER

they don’t think, then you tell them that vaccinated people are the ones that brought in and spread Omicron, and you get a weird look and then you can actually see the dots being connection and then they kinda change the subject as it dawns on them that they fcuked up…..

bjw678

That weird look is cognitive dissonance.

it dawns on them that they fcuked up…..

That very quickly fades and they go back to believing what they did before.

Aussie Soy Boy

Ha ha didn’t you only roll your sleeve up when you bosses threatened your comfortable life?

Hoody

According to guidance published on January 6, U.S. hospitals will no longer be required to report daily COVID deaths to the federal government as part of their general reporting as of Feb. 2. On the same day that the Department of Health and Human Services announced the changes to reporting requirements, none other than Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel published an article in Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA) (with Dr. Michael Osterholm as a co-author), in which he states that the virus is here to stay:

“The goal for the ‘new normal’ with COVID-19 does not include eradication or elimination, e.g., the ‘zero COVID’ strategy. Neither COVID-19 vaccination nor infection appear to confer lifelong immunity. Current vaccines do not offer sterilizing immunity against SARS-CoV-2 infection. Infectious diseases cannot be eradicated when there is limited long-term immunity following infection or vaccination or nonhuman reservoirs of infection.

How long will it take us to follow?

Reus's Large MEMBER

Paving the way for the Pfizermectin type treatments that make more $$$ for big pharma anyway …. so treating whuflu rather than vaccinating for it

Jam

Health care should be evidence based.

Instead of opinion ing on foreign emperical evidence why is the local information reporting so poor? Collectively the cost to EZFKA balance sheets is massive. But I guess that’s not management’s worry just the working units.

I don’t know if ivermectin works, but ‘anecdotal’ information suggests there is something to it. Why at this time of the less virulent strain circulating is there not a locally funded case study using these generic meds?

I do not understand this.

Their might not be money in it , but there would be savings in it.

It was clear around six months ago the jabs have a limited period of effectiveness, fortuitously for fyzer th moronic strain came in time to hide the fact “the Vax has an effective period of less than three months” (my view). And boosters highlight this, that they will need to be taken two to three monthly.

NOTHANKS

This is why I refused the Vax and will probably sacrifice a lot to do so.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Ivermectin is out of patent so it can be made by any company and sold cheap as, for example the whuflu packs they used in Udder Pradesh, which had vitamin D, Ivermectin and Paracetamol cost around $7 for the Indian government who was handing them out for free.

On the other hand the “Pfizermectin”, and I call it that because how it fights / kills the virus is the same as Ivermectin but the compounds used to do it are different, cost around $700 for a course which makes a hell of a lot more money for Pfizer than if they produced Ivermectin which they easily could.

emusplatt

wonder if a cheap arse ivermectin manufacturer will do the requisite studies?… and we can watch pfizzers gouge model blowing up…

Reus's Large MEMBER

So there have been 41 studies using Ivermectin on whuflu, some had really positive results, many have been denied on technicalities, things like typo’s, grammar and other petty things that have nothing to do with the study itself, some were don in such a way that they were guaranteed to fail.

However it is widely used in Africa, India, Indonesia to treat Whuflu, all with resounding success, it is just that the MSM / big tech has done their best to cover it up.

bjw678

a PROPER study is not cheap or quick to conduct. And the margins on ivermectin probably not enough to fund it.
That’s why the probably less effective( but much more patentable) pfizer treatment will get tested and approved.

Medicines regularly get replaced by new one promoted by big pharma that are less effective than existing ones becuase money./patents.

emusplatt

….margins on ivermectin probably not enough to fund it…

BANG … that clears that up

bjw678

Once it isn’t protected by a patent, anyone can make it and competition means it sells for not much more than manufacturing cost.
Something under patent protection on the other hand can sell at 100x or 1000X or 10,000X manufacturing cost…

emusplatt

…and if anyone tries to steal that turf an aggressive drop of the wonderdrug price smashes the new competition…. think WA salt through the late 70’s

plaguerat

On June 23, 2021 PRINCIPLE announced that they were adding Ivermectin to the medications to be subject to a Randomised Trial for the treatment of Covid-19:

Ivermectin to be investigated in adults aged 18+ as a possible treatment for COVID-19 in the PRINCIPLE trial

From today, ivermectin is being investigated in the UK as part of the Platform Randomised Trial of Treatments in the Community for Epidemic and Pandemic Illnesses (PRINCIPLE), the world’s largest clinical trial of possible COVID-19 treatments for recovery at home and in other non-hospital settings.

https://www.principletrial.org/news/ivermectin-to-be-investigated-as-a-possible-treatment-for-covid-19-in-oxford2019s-principle-trial

Since that day I have been periodically checking online to see if any results (tentative or otherwise) have been published.

Today, I find this, posted on Dec 15, 2021:

Ivermectin Arm Of PRINCIPLE Trial Put On Hold

The ivermectin arm of the U.K.’s PRINCIPLE trial is “currently paused due to temporary supply issues,” according to the trial’s website.

The website does not offer any details on what caused the ivermectin supply difficulties in PRINCIPLE, which is investigating possible treatments for COVID-19 and being led by the University of Oxford in England.

https://techilive.in/ivermectin-arm-of-principle-trial-put-on-hold/

I’ve scoured the PRINCIPLE website and cannot find any such announcement, so can’t verify it from the horses mouth (pun intended).

All I can find is an announcement when clicking on the “Join the study” button:

Registration is Paused

Thank you very much for your interest in the PRINCIPLE trial.

Registration for the PRINCIPLE trial is temporarily paused and will be re-open again shortly.

Please check here for further updates.

Nothing specific about Ivermectin or supply issues.

Strange.

Last edited 8 months ago by plaguerat
Reus's Large MEMBER

Dr Malone state that it was designed to fail because of the fact that it was incompetence to not source a supply of the drugs to be tested before the trial started

plaguerat

That makes sense.

Seems like incompetence is an inbuilt feature of this pandemic, no matter which side of the fence one occupies.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Get the lady a prize …. follow the money and you will never be wrong, this has never been about health, it has always been about money

bjw678

Want to bet no one was willing to stump up the money to buy it all up front…

Reus's Large MEMBER

Being that Merck don’t charge for it when used for river blindness and it is off patent, you can get it for about SFA as there are multiple companies that make it now.

So might have cost $1000 if that, which is peanuts for a medical trial

bjw678

So why didn’t they buy any?
I’m guessing because no one would cough up even $1000 for that trial. That should tell you all you need to know.

Last edited 8 months ago by bjw678
bjw678

Instead of opinion ing on foreign emperical evidence why is the local information reporting so poor? 

Because proper studies are actually hard to do, and we don’t really do that much here.

I do not understand this.

Their might not be money in it , but there would be savings in it.

Virtually all research into effectiveness of medicines is funded by pharmaceutical companies. They don’t get the money to pay for those studies by saving people money.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Not entirely true for the whuflu vaccines, the US and German government paid for the the R&D for those, so a very nice meal ticket for big Pharma.

bjw678

Most of the research was done in the decades before wuflu was a thing according to the WHO. Decades of lab research into mrna so it must be safe…
Never mind that no actual safe products were produced in that time. Big pharma just saw a way to get some of that research $$$ back when wuflu turned up.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Yep every long term trail of the mRNA tech killed all the test subjects within 5 years.

LSWCHP

I’m an introvert and am quite happy not having lots of people around, but that’s still a discouraging thought.

plaguerat

The Science for Profit Model—How and why corporations influence science and the use of science in policy and practice
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0253272

Table 1 details the playbook.

Jam

I would think their would be enough willing volunteers willing to participate for free in lieu of having a the vax . But.

Its pretty clear the shift is moving from inoculation to ‘treatment’ type response abroad.

In Queensland I still can’t go to the pub and they are still trying to coerce you to get vaxxed, so wrong. And now I’ve got to work from home for the next farkin month.

bjw678

either COVID-19 vaccination nor infection appear to confer lifelong immunity. Current vaccines do not offer sterilizing immunity against SARS-CoV-2 infection. Infectious diseases cannot be eradicated when there is limited long-term immunity following infection or vaccination

whocouldanode?
Glad we gave up all we did over the last 2 years…

stagmal

soo 36 deaths in nsw today apparently 33 werre fully waxxed?

bjw678

But most of the people in intensive car are unvaxxed. The talking heads told me…

Reus's Large MEMBER

ONS in the UK just released under a FOI request the actual numbers that died “FROM” WhuFlu in the UK in 2020 not “WITH”

It was just under 8000, of which around 7000 were over 65 ….. So only 1000 people under the age of 65 died from whuflu in 2020 in the UK, I am betting that there were far more that died from the jab in 2021 than that.

Reus's Large MEMBER

Full details of the numbers that died from covid without any underlying causes

2020 – 9400 – 7851 over 65
2021 -7971 – 5746 over 65

150k deaths reported with / from covid so roughly 11% of recorded deaths were actually from covid

Reus's Large MEMBER

Yes pretty much, either way the narrative is starting to unravel now and the true picture of how we destroyed the economy and freedoms to enrich the 0.1% is being exposed for all to see the lie that it was based on.

Reus's Large MEMBER

3/36 * 100 = 8.33%

Last edited 8 months ago by Reus's Large MEMBER
stagmal

now that’s gold standard protection!

emusplatt

so the unwax aren’t over represented in death numbers….
working on the 90% waxxed spin

Reus's Large MEMBER

It seems that based on the numbers that there is no significant difference in vaccinated or unvaccinated TBH.

If you are overfed or nearly dead you are at risk, who would have thought …..

stagmal

the focus should be on early prevention and healthy living instead of the waxxines. like what el salavador is doing:

https://twitter.com/nayibbukele/status/1478201251737317385

Reus's Large MEMBER

Exactly, if they really cared about health they would have closed the takeaways and done big promotions on healthy foods and exercise, rather than doing nothing and waiting for a jab that in the words of the Pfizer CEO, offers little if any protection from Omicron, as well as focusing on early treatment options including Ivermectin !

stagmal

i remember one of the big ways they incentivsed the waxxines was “get jabbed and ya can go back to the pub and get pissed to your hearts content” just lol using fucking alcohol as a public health incentive mechanism

drink water, cut the ciggies and the booze eat healthy shit move more you fat pieces of shit

pnut5678

It’s almost as if it was created to enrage people.

pnut5678

It’s starting to feel like we are trying to emulate Pol Pot’s Cambodia here in Oz. Have no connection to others except uncle (the state). And all that creepy cult of personality bullshit for the state premiers and CHO’s. Fuck me. I need a holiday and I can’t fucking go anywhere.

Aussie Soy Boy
pnut5678

And what happens if the unvaccinated don’t stay away?

pnut5678

Fuck me they are going to have the Gestapo hassling the shit out of people. It sounds like it would be as much fun as having an root canal.
Organised fun with the fun police. Give me a break.

https://imgur.com/r/thesimpsons/uvficd6

Ramjet

My view is we will get around 80%. It is like the housing market, measures will be enacted to get a desired outcome.

My rationale:

  1. Areas with lower Covid vaccination rates eg City of Melbourne, City of Yarra have lower number of dependents compared with high vaccination rate areas
  2. Rules will be made that you can’t travel if you are 5+ And are not vaccinated
  3. Victoria admitted it put rules around 12+ being vaccinated to drive teenagers to get vaccinated
  4. Our society is very divided and people are willing to police and shame those who they believe are not obeying
  5. We will have advertising with some kids who got sick to plead with us to take Covid seriously
  6. Laws will be enacted to allow health insurers to have a loading on unvaxxed
  7. Unvaxxed unable to attend school during an outbreak

Peachy, I know it is higher than your 60%, but I am putting a contrarian view that the number will be high which I think we’ll get. It is the coercive measures that will get us there.

bjw678

Laws will be enacted to allow health insurers to have a loading on unvaxxed

Much like the lifetime loading for people who don’t take out health insurance while young this will just push more people out of the system. An outcome I approve of.